WHAT WE SHOULD DO, THE NCAA MAKES BILLIONS -- I'M NOT
           MISSPEAKING -- NOT MILLIONS, BUT BILLIONS OF DOLLARS FROM NCAA
           FOOTBALL, BASKETBALL. I THINK IF THEY ARE SO SINCERE THAT THEY
           WANT TO STOP BETTING ON THESE GAMES, WHY DON'T THEY NOT ALLOW
           THESE GAMES TO BE TELECAST?
           JUST DON'T HAVE ANY COLLEGE GAMES ON TELEVISION, NO FOOTBALL
           GAMES, NO NCAA FINAL FOUR, NO ROSE BOWLS. LET'S JUST OUTLAW

           THEM. THE NCAA IS ALL POWERFUL. THEY COULD DO THAT. THEY THINK.
           BUT WHAT THEY'RE DOING HERE, THEY HAVE BEEN SUCH A DISMAL,
           TOTAL FAILURE AT REGULATING AMATEUR ATHLETICS THAT THEY THINK
           NOW THEY HAVE SOMETHING THEY CAN FINALLY WIN. AND WHAT THEY'RE
           GOING TO DO IS OUTLAW COLLEGE BETTING IN NEVADA, THE ONLY PLACE
           IN THE COUNTRY YOU CAN DO IT LEGALLY. AND AS HAS BEEN SAID
           HERE, LESS THAN 2% OF THE BETTING ON COLLEGE GAMES TAKES PLACE
           IN NEVADA. OVER 98% OF GAMBLING ON COLLEGE GAMES TAKES PLACE

           HERE IN WASHINGTON, D.C., IN THE STATE OF IDAHO, ALL OVER THE
           COUNTRY. IT'S DONE ILLEGALLY. IF THE NCAA IS SO CONCERNED ABOUT
           BETTING ON COLLEGE GAMES, LET'S DO SOMETHING ABOUT THE ILLEGAL
           BETTING THAT TAKES PLACE. LET'S NOT GO AFTER THE LEGAL BETTING.
           LINDSEY GRAHAM ON "HARDBALL," JUST A FEW WEEKS AGO SAID "YOU'RE

           NOT GOING TO STOP ILLEGAL BETTING BY PASSING THE BILL." OF
           COURSE NOT. ORIGINALLY THE NCAA IN ALL THEIR WISDOM SAID, IF WE
           TAKE AWAY THE .5% OF THE LEGAL BETTING AND LEAVE 98.5%, AND
           THEY DON'T ALLOW THE STATE OF NEVADA TO POST ODDS, IT WILL STOP
           ALL OVER THE COUNTRY. NO, NEWSPAPERS, EVERYBODY WILL STOP
           RUNNING THE LINES ON THESE GAMES. AGAIN, OF COURSE, THE NCAA,

           FOR LACK OF A BETTER DESCRIPTION, MR. PRESIDENT, SIMPLY DOESN'T
           KNOW WHAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT. JOHN STERN, THE PRIZ OF THE
           NEWSPAPER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA -- QUOTE -- "SAYS IF CONGRESS
           PROHIBITS GAMBLE ON COLLEGE SPORTS, THE ASSOCIATION OF
           NEWSPAPERS WILL CONTINUE TO HAVE AN INTEREST IN PUBLISHING
           POINT SPREADS ON COLLEGE GAMES SINCE POINT SPREADS APPEAR TO BE
           USEFUL, IN NOT VALUABLE, TO IN READERS WHO HAVE NO INTENTION OF
           BETTING ON GAMES." MR. PRESIDENT, I'VE ALREADY ESTABLISHED
           HERE, I DON'T BET ON GAMES, BUT I LOVE TO KNOW WHAT THE POINT

           SPREAD IS ON A GAME. IT MAKES IT MORE INTERESTING. THEY ARE
           GOING TO PLAY MICHIGAN STATE OR DUKE OR A TEAM LIKE THAT. I'D
           LIKE TO KNOW WHAT THE POINT SPREAD IS TO SEE WHO'S FAVORED.
           THAT DOESN'T MEAN I'M GOING TO RUN DOWN TO THE CORNER BOOKIE
           AND BET ON THE GAME. OR IF I'M IN LAS VEGAS, I DON'T GO TO THE
           HILTON RACE BOOK OR M.G.M. OR ONE OF THOSE PLACES. I WOULDN'T
           KNOW HOW TO PLACE A BET IF YOU ASKED ME TO. BUT I DO KNOW THE
           WAY THEY DO IT IN NEVADA IS BETTER THAN THE WAY THEY DO IT IN
           SERVICE STATIONS AND BOWLING ALICE. -- BOWLING ALLEYS, BARS,

           BECAUSE, YOU SEE, THE ILLEGAL BOOKIES BASE THEIR GAME ON
           CREDIT. USUALLY A WEEK AT A TIME. PEOPLE PLACE BETS WITH THEIR
           ILLEGAL BOOKIE DURING THE WEEK. COME MONDAY OR TUESDAY, THEY
           CAN COME AROUND TO COLLECT THAT MONEY. THAT'S WHERE THE REAL
           TROUBLE STARTS. IN NEVADA, YOU COULD BE ONE FRPTS TEN-RICHEST
           MEN IN THE WORLD, HE OWNS THE M.G.M. AND A NUMBER OF OTHER
           THINGS AROUND THE WORLD. AS RICH AS HE IS -- AND HE OWNS A
           NUMBER OF THESE PLACES -- IF HE WALKED INTO HIS OWN RACE BOOK,
           THE RULES ARE THAT HE CAN GET NO CREDIT. IT HAS TO BE ALL CASH.

           IF HE WANTS TO BET ON A BALL GAME, HE HAS TO PUT UP CASH.
           THERE'S NO CREDIT. IT GOES WITHOUT SAYING WHICH IS THE BETTER
           SYSTEM. THE BETTER SYSTEM IS IN -- IN NEVADA YOU CAN ONLY BET
           WHAT MONEY YOU HAVE IN YOUR POCKET. NO CREDIT ALLOWED. BUT IF
           THE ILLEGAL BOOKIES AROUND THE COUNTRY, CREDIT IS THE NAME OF
           THE GAME. THEY DON'T BREAK AS MANY KNUCKLE AS THEY USED TO, BUT
           THEY SURE PUT THEIR LOANS OUT TO PEOPLE THAT PAY EXORBITANT --
           THAT ARE ASKED TO -- THEY PUT THESE LOANS OUT, AND THE PEOPLE

           THEY ASK TO BORROW THE MONEY SO THEY CAN PAY THEM HAVE TO PAY
           EXORBITANT INTEREST RATES. AND THAT'S WHERE PEOPLE LOSE THEIR
           HOMES AND THEIR CARS AND THEIR PROPERTY. SO WHEN THIS BILL
           COMES UP -- AND IT WILL COME UP -- THIS ISN'T GOING TO BE A
           LAY-DOWN. THE MERITS ARE ON THE SIDE OF WHAT'S GOING ON LEGALLY
           IN THE STATE OF NEVADA. THIS ISSUE IS A SHAM. IT'S A FARCE.
           IT'S A DIVERSION DESIGNATING -- DESIGN, I'M SORRY, MR.

           PRESIDENT, TO DEFLECT ATTENTION FROM AN ORGANIZATION WHILE
           SWIMMING IN MONEY ITSELF EARNED FROM THE SWEAT OF OUR COLLEGE
           KIDS IS INCAPABLE, IT SEEMS, OF DOING ANYTHING POSITIVE. MY
           FAVORITE HAPPENED JUST RECENTLY ST. JOHN'S UNIVERSITY. THEIR
           COACH WHO WAS ALMOST HIRED BY THE LOCAL PROFESSIONAL BASKETBALL
           TEAM, JARVIS, IS COACHING UP THERE. HE HAS A KID THAT HAS A
           USED CAR. A USED CAR. HE TRADES A USED CAR FOR ANOTHER USED
           CAR. THEY SUSPEND HIM FOR PLAY -- FROM PLAYING FOR THREE GAMES.

           THAT REALLY HELPS THE GAME A LOT. THE KID HAS A USED CAR AND
           TRADES IT IN ON ANOTHER USED CAR AND THEY SUSPEND HIM FROM
           PLAYING. THE NCAA HAS -- WHAT THEY DO IS THEY HARASS,
           INTIMIDATE PEOPLE. WE HAVE AN EXAMPLE IN THE STATE OF NEVADA.
           JERRY TARKANIAN, ONE OF THE MOST SUCCESSFUL COACHES IN THE
           HISTORY OF AMERICA. THEY EVENTUALLY RAN HIM OUT OF THE STATE OF
           NEVADA. HE'S NOW COACHING AT FRESNO STATE. THEY HARASSED, DID

           EVERYTHING THEY COULD TO EMBARRASS HIM. BUT HE SUED THEM. IT
           TOOK EIGHT OR NINE YEARS, BUT HE WON THE LAWSUIT. AND THEY HAD
           TO PAY HIM MONEY FOR WHAT THEY DID TO HIM. BUT BY THEN HE HAD
           ALL BEEN RUN OUT OF THE STATE. THE NCAA RECENTLY SIGNED A
           MULTIBILLION-DOLLAR CONTRACT, BROADCASTING CONTRACT. THAT, AS
           FAR AS I'M CONCERNED, NOT A BAD DEAL FOR A NONPROFIT
           ORGANIZATION. PLAYERS, COACHES, ATHLETES RECOGNIZE THE

           UNACCOUNTABLE AND OFTEN UNQUESTIONABLE POWER OF THIS
           ORGANIZATION. THE BEST WAY TO AVOID THE SCRUTINY THAT THEY
           DESERVE -- YOU KNOW, THEY HAVE BEEN SUED LATELY. THEY HAD TO
           PAY OUT MULTIMILLIONS OF DOLLARS TO ASSISTANT COACHES WHO THEY
           WOULD ONLY ALLOW TO RECEIVE -- I FORGET WHAT THE RIDICULOUS SUM
           WAS, LIKE $12,000 A YEAR, $18,000 A YEAR. THE COACHES SUED
           THEM. OF COURSE THE NCAA LOST. THEY APPEALED THAT JUDGMENT.
           THEY LOSE ALL THE TIME IN THE COURTS OF THIS, MR. PRESIDENT, TO

           AVOID SCRUTINY ON THEM IS AN EFFORT TO THROW OUT THE RED
           HERRING, SOG THAT MAYBE PEOPLE WILL TAKE AFTER RATHER THAN WHO
           THEY SHOULD TAKE AFTER, AND THAT'S THEM. THIS LEGISLATION
           SUPPORTED BY MY FRIEND FROM KANSAS WHO COMES HERE ALL THE TIME,
           TALKS ABOUT IT -- I UNDERSTAND -- I DON'T UNDERSTAND. I KNOW
           SENATOR JOHN MCCAIN, THE SENIOR SENATOR FROM ARIZONA, ALSO
           FAVORS THIS LEGISLATION. THIS LEGISLATION DOES NOTHING TO
           ADDRESS THE PROBLEM OF ILLEGAL GAMBLING IN COLLEGE SPORTS. NO
           ONE SUPPORTS ILLEGAL GAMBLING IN COLLEGE SPORTS EXCEPT ILLEGAL

           BOOKIES. AND THEY'LL BE THE PRIMARY BENEFICIARIES OF THE
           LEGISLATION THAT I'M TALKING ABOUT. AND THAT'S NOT ME SPEAKING.
           I READ TO YOU A FEW EXCERPTS FROM EDITORIALS FROM AROUND THE
           COUNTRY. I HAD A FRIEND OF MINE CALLING, CARED A GREAT DEAL
           ABOUT HER. SHE SUFFERED THE LOSS OF HER HUSBAND RECENTLY, AND
           SHE HAS A MONEY AS A RESULT OF THAT. NOT A LOT, BUT A LITTLE
           BIT. SOMEONE CALLED HER AND SAID -- I WON'T MENTION HER NAME.
           IF THIS LEGISLATION PASSES -- TALKING ABOUT THIS LEGISLATION

           BEFORE -- I'M SORRY. THE BROWNBACK LEGISLATION; IT PASSES, YOU
           GIVE ME $20,000, AT THE END OF ONE YEAR I'LL GIVE YOU $200,000
           BECAUSE THAT'S HOW MUCH MONEY I CAN MAKE BY TAKING ILLEGAL
           BETS. CAN'T DO IT NOW BECAUSE PEOPLE WHO WANT TO BET COME FROM
           ALL OVER THE COUNTRY TO BET LEGALLY IN THE STATE OF NEVADA.
           ILLEGAL BOOKIES LOVE THIS LEGISLATION. ONE WHO I HEARD FROM IN

           THE HEARTLAND OF AMERICA TOLD ME -- AND IT'S NOT IN KANSAS BUT
           VERY CLOSE TO KANSAS, WHO TOLD ME THAT THIS WILL BE THE BEST
           THING THAT CONGRESS COULD EVER DO FOR HIS BUSINESS. ALSO, MR.
           PRESIDENT, I HAVE SPOKEN TO LAW ENFORCEMENT AUTHORITIES.
           THERE'S NO QUESTION THAT ONE OF THE LATEST SCANDALS, ARIZONA
           STATE, WHERE THERE WAS SOME ILLEGAL BETTING TAKING PLACE ON
           ARIZONA STATE, THE REASON THAT WAS DISCOVERED IS BECAUSE NEVADA

           REPORTED IT. THEY COULD TELL SOMETHING WAS WRONG BECAUSE OF
           HEAVY BETTING ON ARIZONA STATE, WHICH IN FOOTBALL YOU BET A
           LITTLE ON ARIZONA STATE BUT THERE BASKETBALL TEAM HAS NEVER
           BEEN MUCH TO BET ON. THEY COULD TELL BECAUSE OF THE BETTING
           THAT TOOK PLACE ON ARIZONA STATE THERE WAS SOMETHING THAT WAS
           WRONG. THEY NOTIFIED THE AUTHORITIES, AND THAT'S WHERE THE
           ARREST TOOK PLACE. THEY WERE ABLE TO MAKE A CASE AGAINST THE
           ILLEGAL BETTING THAT WAS TAKING PLACE ON ARIZONA STATE.
           

           MR. PRESIDENT, WHAT WE SHOULD DO IS LOOK AT THE WAY TO STOP
           ILLEGAL BETTING ON COLLEGE CAMPUS. COLLEGE PRESIDENTS ARE
           CONCERNED ABOUT AS WELL THEY SHOULD BE. BUT REMEMBER, WHAT'S
           GOING ON IN NEVADA IS LEGAL AND IT INVOLVES LESS THAN 2% OF
           GAMBLING IN OUR COUNTRY. ELIMINATING GAMBLING ILLEGALLY IN
           NEVADA STATE COLLEGE GAMES WILL DO NOTHING BUT HELP ILLEGAL
           GAMBLING ON COLLEGE GAMES. WE DON'T KNEE NEW LAWS. WE NEAT
           BETTER ENFORCEMENT -- WE DON'T NEED NEW LAWS. WE NEED BETTER

           ENFORCEMENTS. JOHN STERUM, PRESIDENT OF THE NEWSPAPER
           ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA, IN A LETTER TO THE HOUSE JUDICIARY
           COMMITTEE, MADE CLEAR -- AND I QUOTED WHAT HE SAID, THAT
           BASICALLY IF YOU PROHIBIT -- IF CONGRESS PROHIBITS GAMBLING ON
           COLLEGE SPORTS IN NEVADA, IT'S NOT GOING TO STOP ANYTHING THAT
           GOES ON IN THE REST OF THE COUNTRY. AND IT'S CERTAINLY NOT
           GOING TO STOP NEWSPAPERS FROM PUBLISHING THESE LINES. PRESIDENT
           STERUM ALSO DISPELS ANOTHER MYTH PERPETRATED BY THE NATIONAL
           CLEEJ JAT ATHLETIC ASSOCIATION THAT PEOPLE -- COLLEGIATE

           ATHLETIC ASSOCIATION THAT PEOPLE USE THE SPREADS TO PLACE
           ILLEGAL BETS. A RECENT HARRIS POLL FOUND THAT 70% OF THOSE WHO
           LOOK AT POINT SPREADS DO SO ONLY TO OBTAIN INFORMATION. THEY'RE
           LIKE ME, ABOUT A FAVORITE COLLEGE TEAM, ABOUT INFORMATION ON
           UPCOMING COLLEGE GAMES. ANOTHER MYTH PARADED AROUND BY THE
           PROPONENTS OF BANNING LEGAL WAGING ON COLLEGE GAMES IS THIS IS
           DONE BECAUSE THE UNANIMOUS VOTE BY THE MEMBERS OF THE NATIONAL
           COMMISSION TO STUDY GAMBLING. WRONG AGAIN. THAT VOTE WAS VERY

           CLOSE. IT ACTUALLY -- ONE OF THE MEMBERS OF THE COMMITTEE WAS
           FROM NEVADA. HE ABSTAINED. HE SAID IF HE HAD BEEN CALLED UPON
           TO VOTE, IT WOULD HAVE BEEN A 5-4 VOTE. THAT'S FAR FROM
           UNANIMOUS. THE REALITY, MR. PRESIDENT, IS THIS PROPOSAL WAS
           GIVEN LITTLE CONSIDERATION BY THE COMMISSION. THEY HAD MANY
           OTHER THINGS TO TALK ABOUT. THE PROPONENTS OF THE BAN HAD THE
           RIGHT TO THEIR OPINION. BUT THEY'RE ABSOLUTELY WRONG. THEIR

           OPINIONS, MR. PRESIDENT, IN THIS CASE LACK SUBSTANCE. I THINK
           THAT WE NEED TO STEP BACK AND TAKE A LOOK AT THIS. AND THE MAIN
           THING THAT WE NEED TO DO, MR. PRESIDENT, IS UNDERSTAND THE
           LEGAL BUSINESS IN AMERICA IS NOT GOING TO LAY DOWN AND SAY,
           OKAY, RUN OVER US. THERE'S BEEN SOME CRITICISM ABOUT NOT
           LETTING THIS BILL GO FORWARD, NOT HAVING A TIME AGREEMENT ON
           IT. WELL, THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT. THIS
           INVOLVES NOT ILLEGAL GAMBLING ON COLLEGE GAMES. IF THEY WANT TO
           ALREADY -- IF THEY WANT TO ENFORCE THE LAW THAT NOW PROHIBITS

           ILLEGAL GAMBLING OR IF THEY WANT TO PASS A NEW RESTRICTION ON
           ILLEGAL GAMBLING, I'LL STAND BESIDE THEM AND DO THAT. BUT WE'RE
           TALKING ABOUT LESS THAN 2% OF THE GAMBLING AT THAT TAKES PLACE
           ON COLLEGE GAMES, AND IT 2'S DONE LEGALLY. -- AND IT'S DONE
           LEGALLY. DANNY SHERIDAN, ONE OF THE TOPS ODDS MAKERS IN AMERICA
           "USA TODAY," HE SETS THE LINE, HE CAME TO WASHINGTON, TALKED TO
           A NUMBER OF MEMBERS OF CONGRESS. HE SAID I'LL TALK TO WHOEVER
           YOU WANT TO TALK TO. HE SAID I DON'T GAMBLE BUT I SET THE LINE

           AND I'LL CONTINUE TO DO IT NO MATTER WHAT THEY DO IN NEVADA.
           SO, MR. PRESIDENT, WE'VE HAD PEOPLE PARADEING ON THIS FLOOR,
           TALKING -- I SHOULDN'T SAID PARADEING. WE'VE HAD A COUPLE OF
           PEOPLE COME AND TALK ON SEVERAL OCCASIONS ABOUT HOW BAD, WHAT
           GOES ON IN NEVADA IS. IT IS NOT GOING TO GO -- WE'RE NOT GOING
           TO GO WITHOUT OFFERING RESPONSE TO THAT. AND THE TIME HAS COME

           TO OFFER THAT RESPONSE. THE OTHER THING THAT FLABBERGASTS ME
           ABOUT THIS, MR. PRESIDENT, IS WE HAVE PEOPLE WHO COME TO
           CONGRESS AND THEY SAY THEIR NUMBER-ONE ISSUE IS MAKE SURE THEY
           PROTECT STATES' RIGHTS. STATES SHOULD BE ABLE DO WHAT HE HAD
           WANT TO BE ABLE TO DO. WELL, WE FIND A REAL PROBLEM WITH THAT
           SOMETIMES. TAKE, FOR EXAMPLE, PRODUCTS LIABILITY LEGISLATION. I
           PRACTICED LAW. THE STATE OF NEVADA HAD A DIFFERENT SET OF
           STANDARDS THAN DID UTAH, ARIZONA OR
{END: 2000/07/25 TIME: 15-30 , Tue.  106TH SENATE, SECOND SESSION}