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A Century of Lawmaking for a New Nation: U.S. Congressional Documents and Debates, 1774-1875
Journals of the Continental Congress --FRIDAY, MAY 13, 1785.
Congress assembled. Present, New Hampshire, Massachusetts, New York, Pennsylvania, Maryland, Virginia, and South Carolina; and from the state of Rhode Island, Mr. [William] Ellery; from New Jersey, Mr. [John] Beatty; from North Caroling, Mr. [Hugh] Williamson, and from Georgia, Mr. [William] Houstoun.
Mr. David Ramsay, a delegate for the state of South Carolina, attended, and produced credentials under the great seal of the state: by which it appears, that on the 21st February, 1785, he was appointed a delegate to represent that state until the first Monday in November next, and until relieved by the legislature.
A letter, of the 26 March, from J. Rutledge, esquire was read, declining the office of a Judge of the federal court, for
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determining the differences between the states of Massachusetts and New York.1
[Note 1: 1 This letter is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 78, XIX, folio 479.
On this day, according to the indorsement, was read a report from the Secretary at War, Henry Knox, on William Duer's memorial. It was ordered filed September 9, 1785. This report is a duplicate, signed by Knox, of the report stated to have been read in Congress May 12, ante. It is in No. 151, folio 9.]
State of South Carolina
By His Excellency William Moultrie Esquire Governor, and Commander in Chief, in and over the State aforesaid.
To the Honorable David Ramsay Esquire:
Know Ye that by Virtue of the Power and Authority in me Vested by the Honorable the Legislature of this State You are hereby Commissioned as a Delegate to represent this State in Congress and you are to Continue in your Delegation until the first Monday in November next.
And to obviate the Inconveniencies which may arise from the State being at that Time unrepresented you are hereby Authorised to act in Congress as Delegate untill you shall be relieved by the Legislature of this State.
Given under my hand and the Great Seal of the State in the City of Charleston this twenty first day of February in the year of Our Lord One thousand seven hundred and Eighty five and of the Sovereignty and Independence of the United States of America the Ninth.
By His Excellency's Command.
John Vanderhorst,
Secretary.
Willm Moultrie
[With the Great Seal appendant]2
[Note 2: 2 The original is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, South Carolina, Credentials of Delegates. It was entered in No. 179, Record of Credentials, and not in the Journal.]
[Motion of Mr. Charles Pinckney]
Whereas the Legislature of the State of South Carolina have directed their governor to apply to Congress by their Delegates for twelve peices of their heaviest cannon and ball suitable to them, stating that their situation was such that a vessel of small force could with impunity insult the port and lay the City of Charleston under contribution and that they are about to erect therefor works for the defence and security of their harbour, therefore, Resolved,
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that the Secretary at War be directed to furnish the said State with twelve peices of the heaviest cannon belonging to the U. S. and not now in use for which the said State is to be accountable with ball suitable and that he order them to be transported as soon as is convenient to Charleston at the expence of the said State.1
[Note 1: 1 This motion, in the writing of Charles Pinckney, is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 36, II, folio 439. The indorsement states that it was referred on this day to Mr. [William] Grayson, Mr. [Rufus] King and Mr. [Charles] Pinckney. A report was rendered May 23 (No. 20, II, folio 419), read that same day and passed May 26.]
The committee, consisting of Mr. Williamson, Mr. Holten and Mr. Bedford, to whom was referred a letter, of 14 April, from E. Fox, Comr. for settling the accounts of the hospital department, stating reasons against the removal of his Office to this place, agreeably to the Act of the 7th February last, having reported "that he be instructed to continue his Office in Philadelphia for six months from the first of May, at the expiration of which time he shall remove to Charleston in South Carolina, or to such other place as Congress may direct.
On the question, this was disagreed to.
On a motion of Mr. Williamson, seconded by Mr. King,
Ordered, That the committee to whom was referred a memorial of Michael Hillegas, continental treasurer, requesting to be permitted to continue his Office in Philadelphia, be discharged from proceeding in that business.2
[Note 2: 2 Committee Book No. 190 notes that the committee (of April 28) on this Hillegas memorial was discharged.]
The Committee consisting ofto whom was referred a letter from Joseph Pennell Commissioner for settling Marine Accounts, inclosing a letter from John Wereat late Continental Agent in the State of Georgia submit the following Resolve,
That the Board of Treasury take order for selling a quantity of Ship Timber which is in the State of Georgia belonging to the United States.3
[Note 3: 3 This report, in the writing of Hugh Williamson, is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 20, II, folio 447. The committee, left blank above, was the same as that mentioned in the indorsement which states that the report was read this day and referred to Mr. [Samuel] Hardy, Mr. [Samuel] Holten, Mr. [William Samuel] Johnson, Mr. [Hugh] Williamson and Mr. [Jacob] Read. See ante, January 20, also post, June 13.]
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The Committee consisting [of Mr. Samuel Hardy, Mr. Samuel Holten, Mr. William Samuel Johnson, Mr. Hugh Williamson and Mr. Jacob Read] to whom was referred a letter from Joseph Pennell Commissioner for settling Marine Accounts respecting the Commissions to be allowed to the late agent in that Department submit the following Resolve.
That the Letter from Joseph Pennell of the 15th Jany. with its enclosures be referred to the Board of Treasury to report.1
[Note 1: 1 This report, in the writing of Hugh Williamson, is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 28, folio 219. The indorsement states that it was acted on this day. See post, June 13. Pennell's letter is in No. 31, folio 95.]
[Report of Grand Committee viz. Mr. [David] Howell, Mr. [Abiel] Foster, Mr. [Rufus] King, Mr. [Joseph Platt] Cook, Mr. [Melancton] Smith, Mr. [John] Beatty, Mr. [Joseph] Gardiner, Mr. [John] Vining, Mr. [William] Hindman, Mr. [James] Monroe, Mr. [Hugh] Williamson, Mr. [Charles] Pinckney and Mr. [William] Houstoun]
PROPOSITIONS RESPECTING THE COINAGE OF GOLD, SILVER, AND COPPER.
1st. The value of Silver Compared with Gold. 2d. The Weight or Size of the several Pieces of money that are to be made. 3d. The Money Arithmetic, or the mode in which it is to be counted; and 4th, The Charges of Coinage are to be considered.
1. In France, 1 Grain of pure Gold is counted worth 15 Grains of Silver. In Spain 16 grains of Silver are exchanged for 1 of Gold, and in England 15⅕th. In both of the Kingdoms last mentioned, Gold is the prevailing Money; because Silver is undervalued. In France Silver prevails. Sundry advantages would arise to us from a system by which Silver might become the prevailing Money. This would operate as a Bounty to draw it from our Neighbours, by whom it is not sufficiently esteemed. Silver is not exported so easily as Gold, and it is a more useful Metal.
Certainly our Exchange should not be more than 15 Gr. of Silver for 1 of Gold. It has been alledged by the late Financier, that we should not give more than 14½ perhaps 14¾ would be a better medium, considering the Quantity of Gold that may expected from Portugal.
2. The Weight, Size or Value of the several Pieces of money that shall be made, or rather the most convenient Value of the Money
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Unit, is a Question not easily determined, considering that most of the Citizens of the U. S. are accustomed to count in Pounds, Shillings and Pence; and that those sums are of different Values in the different States: hence they convey no distinct Ideas. The money of the U. S. should be equally fitted to all. The late Financier has proposed to make Gold and Silver Pieces of particular Weight; and there is a very simple process, by which the imaginary money of the Several States may be translated into such Pieces, or vice versa. He proposes that the Money Unit be one Quarter of a Grain of pure Silver, That the smallest Coin be of Copper, which shall be worth 5 of those Units. The smallest Silver Coin to be worth 100 Units, another to be worth 500, another of 1000 and thus encreasing Decimally.
The objections to this Plan are, that it introduces a Coin unlike in Value to any thing now in Use. It departs from the national mode of keeping Accounts, and tends to preserve inconvenient Prejudices. Whence it must prevent national Uniformity in Accounts; a thing greatly to be desired.
Another Plan has been offered, which proposes, [that the Money Unit be One Dollar; and the smallest coin is to be of Copper, of which 200 shall pass for one Dollar.] This Plan also proposes, [that the several Pieces shall increase in a Decimal Ratio] and that all Accounts be kept in Decimals, which is certainly by much the most short and simple mode.
In favour of this Plan it is urged, that a Dollar, the proposed Unit, has long been in general Use. Its Value is familiar. This accords with the national mode of keeping Accounts, and may in time produce the happy effect of Uniformity in counting money throughout the Union.
3. The Money Arithmetic, though an important Question, is one that can admit of little Dispute. All accomptants must prefer Decimals.
4. What is the best mode of defraying the Expence of Coinage? Different Nations have adopted different Systems. The British value their Silver when coined, no higher than Bullion. Hence it follows, that the expense of the Mint, increasing the civil List must be paid by a general Tax, and Tradesmen are disposed to work up the current Coin, by which the Tax is increased and continued. In some other Countries Silver or Gold when coined are valued above the Price of Bullion, whence Tradesmen are discouraged from melting or working up the current Coin, and the Mint is rather profitable
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than burdensome. Certainly there are good and conclusive reasons, why we should value the national Coin above the Price of Bullion; but there is a certain Point beyond which we may not proceed, lest we encourage counterfeits, or private Imitations of our Coin. It has been proposed to make a difference of 2½ p Ct. nearly as an allowance for the Coinage of Gold, and of 3.013 p Ct. for the Coinage of Silver. It is probable that 3 p. Ct. would more than defray the Expense of coining Silver, in which Case it would be a Temptation to private Imitation, and would operate against the free circulation of the money as being valued too high. It is to be remembered that Silver Coin ought to be encouraged and probably 2 p Ct. or 2¼ p Ct. would be a proper difference between Silver Coined and Bullion. The same difference to be made in the Price of Gold. If this does not fully pay the Expenses of the Mint, there will be a much larger Gain on the Coinage of Copper; and if there should remain a small Balance against the Mint, its Operation will not be unfavorable.
The Coinage of Copper is a Subject that claims our immediate Attention. From the small Value of the several Pieces of copper Coin, this medium of Exchange has been too much neglected. The more valuable Metals are daily giving Place to base British half Pence, and no means are used to prevent the Fraud. This Disease which is neglected in the Beginning, because it appears trifling, may finally prove very destructive to commerce. It is admitted that Copper may at this Instant be purchased in America at 1/8 of a Dlr the Pound. British half Pence made at the Tower are 48 to the Pound. Those manufactured at Birmingham and ship'd in Thousands for our Use, are much lighter, and they are of base Metal. It can hardly be said that 72 of them are worth a Pound of Copper. Hence it will follow, that we give for British half Pence about six Times their Value. There are no Materials from which we can estimate the Weight of half Pence that have been imported from Britain since the late War. But we have heard of sundry Shipments being ordered, to the nominal amount of 1,000 Guineas, and we are told, that no Packet arrives from England, by which we are not accommodated with some hundred Weight of base Half Pence. It is a very moderate Computation which States our Loss on the last 12 months, at 30 Thousand Dollars by the Commerce of vile Coin. The whole Expence of a Mint would not have amounted to half of that Sum, and the whole Expence of domestic Coinage would remain in the Country.
The following forms of Money are submitted.
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The Quantity of pure Silver being fixed that is to be in the Unit or Dlr, and the relation between Silver and Gold being fixed, all the other Weights must follow.
When it is considered, that the Spaniards have been reducing the Weight of their Dlrs. and that instead of 385.5, the Grams of pure Silver in the old Mexican Dollar, the new Dollars have not more than 365 Grains, it will hardly be thought that 362 Grams of pure Silver is too little for the federal Coin, which is to be current in all Payments for One Dollar. Some of the old Dlrs will admit of a second Coinage, but the new ones will not. If the Value of Gold compared to that of Silver, be fixed at 15 to one, and the Alloy in each be 1/12, the Weight of the several Denominations will be readily determined.
The Price of Bullion is immediately determined by the percentage that is charged towards the Expences of the Mint.
If the U. S. shall determine to adhere to the Dollar as their Money of Account, and to simplify Accounts by the Use of Decimals, there is nothing to prevent the immediate commencement of a Coinage of Copper.
Let the copper Pieces, of which 100 are to pass for a Dlr, contain each 131 Grains of pure Copper, or 44 of them weigh 1 Pound. In this case our copper Coin, when compared with the Money of Account, will be 6 p Ct. better than that of Great Britain. There will remain a sufficient Profit on the Coinage.
Copper of the best Quality in Plates, may be purchased in Europe at 10½ Stg. In cutting Blanks there will be a waste of 22 p Ct. Those Clippings are worth 7d½ p lb. Hence the blanks will cost 11d½ nearly; it may be stated at ls. 9d. New York Money p Pound, exclusive of the Expence of cutting them, which is not great, as one Man can readily cut 100 Wt. in a day.
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The Operation improperly called milling, by which the sharp edges are worn off from the Coppers, is not more expensive than cutting the Blanks.
In the Process of coining Copper, Eight Artists or Labourers may be required.
One Engraver, 1 Labourer for the blank Press. One Smith, 5 Labourers for the coining Press. By those people 100 Weight of Copper may readily be coined every Day, or the Value of 44 Dlrs. Deducting the necessary Expences, there may be saved 30 p Ct.
It is not of any importance by what Name our Copper Coin is distinguished, but it should have some Name. They are not to be Pence nor half Pence and though they might be of the same Value we should not have such Words in our Language as applicable to our own Money. The French have their Sous and the Dutch their Doits and Stivers; perhaps from the circumstance of our Coin being numbered by Decimals we might call some Piece of Money a Decad--let it be the largest Copper.
Device and Inscription for one Side1
[Note 1: 1 This report, in the writing of Hugh Williamson, is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 26, folios 537--542.
The printed copy of the report (a folio pamphlet of 12 pages) contains: 1st, the Propositions as written out by Williamson, with a ms. line drawn around the phrases enclosed in brackets and the words "agreed" noted against them. 2d, the letter from Robert Morris, dated January 15, 1782. 3d, a plan, or suggestion, of coinage, which, in the writing of Gouverneur Morris, is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 26, folio 557. 4th, "Notes on the Establishment of a Money Mint, and of a coinage for the United States. By Mr. Jefferson." It is endorsed with the names of the Grand Committee: Mr. [David] Howell, Mr. [Abiel] Foster, Mr. [Rufus] King, Mr. [Joseph Platt] Cook, Mr. [Melancton] Smith, Mr. [John] Beatty, Mr. [Joseph] Gardner, Mr. [John] Vining, Mr. [William] Hindman, Mr. [James] Monroe, Mr. [Hugh] Williamson, Mr. [Charles] Pinckney and Mr. [William] Houstoun.
The ms. report is indorsed by Thomson: "Read May 13, 1785 Thursday next assigned for consideration To be printed with the plans of the late Superint. of finance and of Mr. Jefferson." and in another hand: "Mint established on principles reported by the board of treasury and passed--Augt. 8, 1786. See Instructions to Delegates of Massachusetts--read Decr. 3d 1784." See post, July 6, and ante, 1782, Feb. 21. The report of the committee there referred to is indorsed by Thomson: "1785, Jany. 25 Super int: letter 15 Jany 1782 on a Mint referred to Grand Comee." Jefferson's Notes are in No. 26, folio 545. They were printed in The Providence Gazette and Country Journal for July 24, 1784, Vol. XXI, No. 1073, a copy of which is in No. 26, folio 559.]
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Board of Treasury, May 12th., 1785.
The Board of Treasury to whom was referred the Memorial of John McKinly of the State of Delaware submit the following Resolve.
That the Commissioner for settling the accounts of Delaware with the United States be directed to adjust the accounts of John McKinly Esq. for monies expended for the United States and for monies lost, agreeably to the principles established in the 4th. clause of a Resolve of Congress of the 3d. of June 1784.1
[Note 1: 1 This report, signed by Samuel Osgood and Walter Livingston, is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 138, II, folio 97. According to the indorsement it was read this day and referred to Mr. J[ohn] Henry, Mr. [William] Ellery and Mr. [Charles] Pinckney, who reported May 19. McKinley's memorial is in No. 42, V, folio 315. See ante, May 11.]
[Motion referred May 13, 1785 to the Secy. of Congress to take order]
That the S[ecretary] cause the room in which his office is at present kept to be prepared for the session of C and that the portraits of the K[ing] and Q[ueen] of F[rance] be fixed in the said room.2
[Note 2: 2 This motion, in the writing of Charles Pinckney, is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 36, II, folio 435.]
Board of Treasury, May 12, 1785.
The Board of Treasury, to whom the letter of William Winder of 17th March 1785 Commissioner of Accounts for the State of Delaware--was referred.
Report, That having maturely considered the embarrassments suggested in the said letter, they are of opinion; that they are effectually provided for in the Resolutions of Congress of the 20th February 1782 and 3d. June, 1784 For that in all cases whatever where the rule prescribed by Congress of the 26th August 1780, cannot with justice to individuals, or any decree of accuracy be applied.
The Commissioners are authorized to exercise a discretionary power in Liquidating accounts on such principles, as by the said Resolutions are prescribed--They are further of opinion that the applying any special Rule for particular cases (except in points
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where the Resolves of Congress have clearly made no provision) will operate more injury than can be derived from an adherence to the general principles, adopted by Congress.1
[Note 1: 1 This report, signed by Samuel Osgood and Walter Livingston, is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 138, II, folio 561. See ante, April 28.]
The Committee consisting of [Mr. Hugh Williamson, Mr. Melancton Smith, Mr. William Grayson, Mr. James Wilson and Mr. David Howell] to whom was referred the memorial of the late Contractors for the moving Army report.
That on the 6th of April, 1780, the memorialists entered into a Contract with the Superintendant of Finance for supplying the moving Army with Rations at a certain price on condition of having payment made them in solid coin at fixed periods.
That from the failure of the several States to pay sufficient sums into the treasury the Financier had it not in his power to make the stipulated payments; the Contractors in that situation were unable to continue to furnish the Army with provisions and the Financier made a new Contract with other persons on other terms before their contract had expired.
The Memorialists alledge that they have suffered considerable damages by the failure on the part of the Financier to make his payments according to agreement and by his depriving them of their contract after they have sustained it during the most expensive period and pray that the same may be considered and that they may be indemnified from the losses they have suffered.
On which your Committee submit
That D. Mercier, William Malcolm and Isaac Roosevelt Esqrs. having made oath that they will faithfully discharge this trust be authorized to inquire into the particulars and finally to determine what damages if any have been sustained by Tench Francis, Comfort Sands and others late Contractors for the moving army from the Financier having failed to make good the stipulated payments, or from the withdrawing the contract and the Board of Treasury shall take order for paying the damages if any that shall appear to have been sustained make report to Congress.2
[Note 2: 2 This report, in the writing of Hugh Williamson, is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 21, folio 379. It was passed May 27. See ante April 5.
Also, according to the indorsement, a letter from the Secretary at War, dated May 10, was this day read, regarding the depreciation of pay of Colonel La Radiere and recommending a modification of the resolution of April 10, 1780, so that officers and soldiers who died, or were killed, in the service might be allowed depreciation of their pay. It is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 150, I, folio 5.
Also on this day, according to the indorsement, was read the report of the Secretary for Foreign Affairs dated May 13, on a letter from Richard Soderstrom, of March 21. Jay's letter is in No. 81, I, folio 219. It recommends that all Consuls, both U. S. and foreign be held amenable to the laws of the nations in which they officiate and that no notice be taken of the irregular recognition of Soderstrom by the Governor of Massachusetts. "Thursday next assigned for consideration" of this report.
Also on this day, according to Committee Book No. 190, the petition of William Hoskins for a settlement of his account was referred to the Board of Treasury to report. The report was rendered November 30 and passed February 1, 1786. The petition dated May 12, 1785, is in No. 42, II folio 479; Hoskins' account accompanies it and is on folio 484.
On this day also, according to Despatch Book No. 185, She petition of Toussaint Lopez, praying for payment of his certificates, was ordered "put on the same footing with his Countrymen in respect to what is due him." The petition, undated, is in No. 42, IV, folio 356. It is indorsed by Thomson: "May 18 Ordered to lie." See post, May 30.
May 13: The following committees were appointed: Mr. [Rufus] King, Mr. [John] Lawrance, Mr. J[ohn] Henry, Mr. [William] Ellery and Mr. [James] Monroe on the petition of the legislature of South Carolina for a federal court to settle boundary differences between that State and Georgia. The petition is dated 1784, March 24, and is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 72, folio 575. It is dated March 24, 1785. A later indorsement by Roger Alden notes: "See Journal Augt. 9th 1787 & Acts of the State. Agreement filed." See post, May 17 and June 1, 1785.
Mr. [James] Monroe, Mr. W[illiam] Henry and Mr. [Melancton] Smith on the memorial of Mordecai Hale praying financial aid on account of having been disabled in service. The memorial is in No. 41, IV, folio 285, is dated May 11, 1785 and bears a certificate of Governor George Clinton. It is indorsed by Roger Alden: "The certificates delivered to the Memorialist 10th Augt. 1785."
Mr. [William] Ellery, Mr. [Samuel] Holton and Mr. [Melancton] Smith on the memorial of Mathew Dubois to be allowed for forage furnished the French Army. It is noted by Thomson: "Sept. 19 discharged papers to be returned to Mr. Dubois on his application."
Mr. [John] Lawrance, Mr. [William] Ellery and Mr. [Abiel] Foster on Rev. Henry Purcell's petition to be allowed pay as chaplain and as Judge Advocate. A report was rendered May 19. The petition is dated 1785, April 15, and is in No. 42, VI, folio 371, and indorsed "Acted on May 12, 1786."
Committee Book No. 190.]
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