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A Century of Lawmaking for a New Nation: U.S. Congressional Documents and Debates, 1774-1875
Journals of the Continental Congress --TUESDAY, AUGUST 2, 1785.
Congress assembled. Present, New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, New York, Pennsylvania, Maryland, Virginia, South Carolina and Georgia; and from the state of Connecticut, Mr. [Joseph Platt] Cook; from Delaware, Mr. [John] Vining, and from North Carolina, Mr. [William] Cumming.
A motion being made by Mr. [James] McHenry, seconded by Mr. [Samuel] Hardy, and the same being amended to read,
That the board of treasury, on the first Monday in every month, lay before Congress an abstract of the receipts and expenditures of the preceding month, with the balance remaining in the public treasury, and also an Abstract of any Contracts that they may have made in that month.1
[Note 1: 1 The motion, in the writing of McHenry, is in No. 36, III, folio 95. It reads: "That the board of treasury on the first Monday in every month lay before Congress or a committee of the States an abstract of the receipts and expenditures and participations of the preceeding month and with the balance then remaining in the public treasury and also an abstract of any contracts they have made on the part of"
The words lined out so appear in the motion.]
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A motion was made by Mr. [Samuel] Holten, seconded by Mr. [Elbridge] Gerry,
That the motion as amended, be referred to the committee appointed to revise the regulations of the treasury department, and report an Ordinance for its future regulation; and on the question to commit, the yeas and nays being required by Mr. [James] McHenry,
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So the question was lost.
A division was then called for by Mr. [John] Lawrance; and on the question to agree to the first clause, as far as "public treasury," inclusive, the yeas and nays being required by Mr. [William] Grayson,
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So it was Resolved, That the board of treasury, on the first Monday in every month, lay before Congress an abstract of the receipts and expenditures of the preceding month, with the balance remaining in the public treasury.
On the question to agree to the latter Clause, viz. also an abstract of any contracts that they may have made in that month, the yeas and nays being required by Mr. [William] Grayson,
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So the question was lost.
On Motion of Mr. [Charles] Pinckney, seconded by Mr. [Elbridge] Gerry,
Resolved, That the board of treasury take order to pay Oliver Pollock fifteen hundred dollars, in part of the interest due to him from the United States.1
[Note 1: 1 On this day, according to Committee Book No. 190, Mr. [James] McHenry's motion of July 29 relative to the settlement of state accounts was referred to the Grand Committee of August 1.]
Office for Foreign Affairs,
2d August, 1785.
Sir: On Friday last Mr De Marbois called upon me to enquire whether Congress had as yet directed any Answers to be given to his Memorials under their Consideration. In the course of Conversation he mentioned the Affair of Longchamps and informed me that his Court would not persist in their Demand of him. He proposed that the Paper containing that Demand together with those that accompanied it should be returned to him, so that the Matter might remain as if no such Demand had been made. If this Idea should be adopted the proposed Letter to his Most Christian Majesty would be unnecessary, if not improper. He expressed a Wish that Congress would pass Resolutions asserting the Rights of Ministers &c. and recommending to the States to pass Laws to punish Violations of them in an exemplary Manner. If Congress should think proper to pass such Resolutions a Copy of them might be enclosed to the King of France
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in a Letter calculated to remove any uneasiness which may remain in his Mind from the Case of Longchamps.
I have the Honor to be etc.
John Jay.1
[Note 1: 1 This report is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 80, I, folio 329. It was read this day and, according to indorsement, was referred back to the Secretary for Foreign Affairs to report. According to Committee Book No. 190, he reported on August 23.]
His Excellency,
The President of Congress.
Board of Treasury,
1st August, 1785.
Sir: We do ourselves the honor of transmitting to Congress the Report of this Board on the representation of Le Sieur Marbois, Chargé des Affairs of His most Christian Majesty.
The importance of the subject and the pressing solicitations of Mr. Marbois, to have a decision on the objects of his representation, will, we have no doubt, induce Congress to give the Report an early consideration.2
[Note 2: 2 This letter, signed by Samuel Osgood and Walter Livingston, is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 140, I, folio 9. According to the indorsement it was read this day, with the report, which is in No. 138, II, folio 105, and is dated July 30. A broadside of this report, on folio 217, is indorsed as referred, March 2, 1786, to Pinckney, King and Lawrance, but these names were, afterwards, crossed off by Thomson.]
The Board of Treasury to whom was referred on the 7th. July Instant, a Paper from Le Sieur Marbois Chargé des Affaires of his most Christian Majesty dated 16th. of May last, Report,
That they have examined the purport of the said paper, and find that the objects of Monsieur Marbois' representation are,--
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The Board having maturely considered the objects of the above representation, submit on the first head to the consideration of Congress the following Resolves.
That the several states be again urged to make provision for paying up the arrearages of interest due to Foreigners, on loan office Certificates issued in their respective States, so as to place these claimants on a footing with their own citizens; and that in all future laws which may make provision for the payment of interest due by the United States, it be strongly recommended to them to make no distinction betwixt their own citizens and the subjects of a Foreign power.
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That to enforce this resolve, a circular letter by be signed the President, and transmitted to the Supreme Executives of the respective States, to be laid before the several Legislatures, stating the principles of justice upon which this requisition is founded, how repugnant a distinction in the payment of public debts is to the usage of all civilized nations who know the value of national credit, even in time of war, and the injury which may arise to the union by any discrimination in the payment of public debts, betwixt the Citizens of these States and the subjects of Foreign Powers.
That in all eases where the Loan Officers of the respective states are authorized, in consequence of the requisitions of Congress to issue certificates redemable in taxes, for the payment of interest, they be directed to issue certificates of interest to the subjects of Foreign Powers for monies loaned in their respective offices. And that these certificates be received in Taxes due to the United States in the same manner, with those granted to Domestic Creditors in the several States.
That in the regulation of the Office and Duties of the respective loan Officers, or receivers of taxes, Congress will from time to time make such provision as may ensure the execution of the just purposes intended by the foregoing resolve.
On the second head they submit the following Resolves.
That the Chargés des Affaires of His Most Christian Majesty be informed, that the Resolve of Congress of the 17th March last, limiting the time for settlement of claims of individuals against the United States, cannot be construed to extend to foreigners not resident within the United States. That Le Sieur Marbois be requested to lodge an abstract of the Continental money, the bona fide property of the subjects of His Most Christian Majesty, with the Commissioners of the Board of Treasury, specifying the amount and the date of the deposit, the name of the person by whom, and on whose account the deposit was made, together with such other evidence, authenticating the same, as Monsieur Marbois may be able to furnish; and that Congress will cause the same to be liquidated on as favorable principles, as the circumstances attending the circulation of that Currency, and the claims of other holders of Continental Paper can possibly admit of.
On the third head, they submit the following Resolve. That Le Sieur Marbois be informed that Mr. Bingham late agent for the
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United States, at Martinico, has received the whole of his demand against the said States to enable him to satisfy those engagements, for which he had made himself personally responsible whilst in the Island of Martinico. That they presume, notwithstanding Mr. Binghams absence, the laws of the State of Pennsylvania (the seat of his property, and former residence) will afford a remedy to the Claimants; but should there be any defects in such laws, it cannot be doubted but the legislature of Pennsylvania, from a regard to the principles of justice, will on a proper representation, make provision for enabling foreigners to recover their just claims against such of their citizens as may be absent from the State.
With respect to the fourth head which relates to a debt alledged to be due to Messrs Sabatier & Despres--The Board find that Messrs Sabatier & Despres allege that they were authorized on the requisition of Col. Laurens to purchase goods to an amount exceeding two million of livres; which are charged to the United States, and included in the loan of Ten Million livres; but that it does not appear that the Accounts of these disbursements were examined and admitted by any person on the part of the United States.
That the balance stated to be due to the Royal Treasury of France for their advance to Messrs. Sabatier & Despres, is one hundred thirty four thousand and sixty five Livres, seven Sols, six Deniers; which sum arises from charges of transportation and an additional allowance of four per cent commission on the payments made by that house; the sum of six per cent having been before allowed them for advances, commission trunks and packages.
That although it is not consistent with the independence of these United States or their established rules of office to have the accounts of persons employed in their service liquidated under any other authority than what is derived from them, Yet in as much as the whole purchase of these goods is actually included in the contract of Ten Million of Livres, and the balance claimed by Messrs. Sabatier & Despres, paid by the Royal Treasury of France, the Board of Treasury submit to the consideration of Congress the following Resolves.
That the sum of one hundred and thirty four thousand sixty five Livres, seven Sols, six Deniers paid by the Royal Treasury of France to Messrs. Sabatier & Despres in full of a balance claimed by them from the United States be acknowledged as a debt due from the United
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States to the Royal Treasury of France. That Congress will take measures for reimbursing the same, as soon as the State of the finances will admit of it and that it shall in the mean time bear an interest of five per cent from the date of the advance.
Resolved, That the admission of the accounts of Messrs. Sabatier & Despres for the purchases and services performed by them on account of the United States, on a requisition of one of their Ministers, shall not be considered as a precedent for the future allowance of any claims made on them, which are not previously liquidated, under the authority of these United States.
Resolved, That the Board of Treasury direct Mr. Barclay to procure and transmit a particular state of the accounts, exhibited by Messrs. Sabatier & Despres to the Royal Treasury of France for expenditures made by them on account of the United States.
On the fifth head of the representation, which requires information on the effects which have followed from the resolution of Congress of the 16th of April 1784 relative to the payment of the interest, and future instalments of the principal of the debt due to France from the United States--The Board beg leave to Report.
That they do not find from the Journals of Congress that any measures have been adopted by the United States for procuring funds for the payment of the principal and interest of the debt due to France agreably to contract, since the general requisition of Congress of the 28th April, 1784.
That, notwithstanding that requisition (looking forward to a compliance, on the part of the several States with the Resolve of Congress of the 18th April, 1783, for establishing permanent funds) confined itself to a demand of the interest on the National Debt, for one year only, and the sum actually necessary for the support of the civil establishment, the several States in the Union paid in in the course of 1784 but five hundred and twenty two thousand, one hundred and sixty two Dollars, out of Two Million six hundred and seventy thousand, nine hundred and eighty seven Dollars the amount of that requisition.
That the Superintendant of Finance in the month of October last, remitted to Monsieur Grand, banker to the United States at Paris, the sum of four hundred thousand livres for the express purpose of paying the interest for the year 1784, on the Ten Million livres borrowed of Holland and guarranteed by France; that Mr. Grand has paid
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into the Royal Treasury of France, the moiety of that sum, reserving the balance for the discharge of other engagements of the United States which were from time to time falling due.
That although the present state of the finances render it extremely difficult to defray the ordinary charges of the civil establishment, the Board have made effectual arrangements for the punctual payment of the whole interest which will become due in November next, on the loan of Ten Million livres guarranteed by France.
That such is the present stagnation in the receipt of taxes, that it is impossible for this Board to give any assurance of further payments of interest due to France in the course of the present year, unless the United States in Congress should urge the states to an immediate and vigorous exertion in the collection of the arrearages of Taxes, due on the requisitions of the 4th. September, 1782 and 28th April, 1784.
On this head of the representation of the Chargé des Affairs of His Most Christian Majestys, the Board have confined themselves to the statement of the effects, which have flowed from the Resolve of Congress of the 16th April, 1784 and the measures adopted by the late and present administration of the Treasury with respect to the payment of the annual interest due to France.
However anxious to see the public revenue placed on so solid a basis, as to put it in the power of the United States, to pay with punctuality the interest of the National Debt, so justly due, and so long delayed, the Board can only be responsible for the prudent and faithful disposition of those monies which actually come into their hands. Though an anticipation of the public revenue might have been justifiable in time of actual invasion, without any certain funds being provided for its redemption, it would argue a want of prudence and those principles of probity, which ought to characterise the administration of the finances in every well governed State, to enter into great anticipations in time of profound peace, without any established system of revenue and for purposes, to which no uncommon exertions in the collection of Taxes, are necessary.
With all deference to Congress, the Board beg leave to observe that the payment of the interest, and the discharge of the principal of the Foreign Debt, at the stipulated instalments, is in their opinion a primary object. In the course of this year, two years interest will be due on the loan of Six Millions of Livres; and though the interest on the loan of Eighteen Million of Livres is not payable tiff three years
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after the peace, when the respective instalments become redeemable, such an accumulation of interest added to the weight of the proportionate payment of Principal, may (if postponed) prove too burthensome to discharge in the course of one year.
The funds necessary for the discharge of the interest of the national debt ought (in the opinion of this Board) to be certain in their collection, and adequate to their object. From the experience of past annual Requisitions, there is no reason to think them competent to these ends. Whatever, therefore modifications may at present be admitted for the discharge of Domestic Interest, that due for the Foreign Debt must be paid at the places, and periods stipulated in the contracts: if the respective states provide certain and adequate funds, payable in solid coin for their proportionate share of this interest (which may with sufficient precision be ascertained from their respective quotas), The Board presume they would not find much difficulty in entering into advantageous Contracts for the payment of the Foreign Interests, with merchants of reputation, who would export for this purpose the commodities of the several States where the funds are provided: in this manner the Board have secured the payment of the interest on the Ten Million Loan due in November next. The money necessary for this object (being part of the quta of Virginia.) is expended in the purchase of tobacco, and the contractors lodge in France, the amount received at the advantageous exchange of Five Livres Eight Sols pr Dollar.
Solid advantages would arise not only to the United States, but to the several Members of the Union from such an operation. To the United States; because it would save them from the painful dilemma of holding up to their Foreign Creditors assurances of payment which (though made with the purest intentions) prove in the end fallacious, for want of permanent and regular funds being provided by the Several States and because it would enable them to remit the interest and principal of the Foreign Debt, without engaging in commercial adventures (always if possible to be avoided by public bodies) or being reduced to the necessity of remitting, at an exchange, far above the par of coin. To the several states; because by preserving by this operation the coin in their Country, it would facilitate the collection of taxes, whilst it promoted the sale of their products, and the employment of the shipping necessarily engaged in vesting these funds.
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With respect to the memorial of Monsieur Le Ray du Chaumont, in behalf of himself and other merchants of France, holders of Continental money and Loan Office certificates, the Board are of opinion that the memorialists should be referred to the decision of Congress, on the representation of the Chargé des Affaires of His Most Christian Majesty.
All which is, with deference toe judgment of Congress submitted.1
[Note 1: 1 The report, signed by Samuel Osgood and Walter Livingston, is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 138, II, folio 105. According to Committee Book No. 191, it was read this day and transferred. Thomson has indorsed it: "Wednesday Jany. 26, 1785 assigned." This date should have been 1786. A printed copy of this report, on folio 217, has been indorsed by Thomson: "March 2, 1786 Referred to Mr. Pinckney, Mr. King Mr. Lawrence" Later he crossed these names over. See ante, May 27, 1785.]
Board of Treasury,
30th. JULY, 1785.
The Committee [consisting of Mr. Hugh Williamson, Mr. Edward Hand and Mr. David Howell] to whom was referred the Memorial of Captn. Phelon dated on February last requesting that in Consideration of his having been wounded in the Service other Provision may be made for him in addition to the Commutation for half Pay to which he is entitled, beg Leave to report that on the 30th. of Septr. last on the Recommendation of sundry Genl Officers Edward Phelon then a Lieut. was in consideration of his Services and suffering promoted to the Rank of a Captn. in the Line by which his half Pay or Commutation is considerably increased wherefore your Committee submit the following Resolve
That the memorial of Captn. Phelon be dismissed.
That the Request of Captn. Phelon cannot be granted.2
[Note 2: 2 This report, in the writing of Hugh Williamson, is in the Papers of the Continental Congress, No. 19, V, folio 143. According to indorsement it was read this day and referred to Mr. [David] Howell, Mr. [David] Ramsay and Mr. [John] Habersham. See post, August 5, 1785. Phelon's February 1784 memorial is in No. 41, VIII, folio 180. According to indorsement it was referred to the Committee of the Week who reported that the memorial be read in Congress. This was done April 1, 1784, and it was then referred to Williamson, Hand and Howell, as above. According to Committee Book No. 186, this committee reported April 13; the report, however, was not read in Congress until August 2, 1785. See post, August 5.]
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